Comments on The Pensive Quill: Them Protestants

Fionnchú, Tommy McKearney would be right in that...

2011-06-10T20:31:31.046+01:00

Fionnchú,

Tommy McKearney would be right in that regard. Thee s a resonance in my own writing where I refer to SF as a Catholic party

Good way to teach a lasting lesson to your daughte...

2011-06-09T00:12:40.762+01:00

Good way to teach a lasting lesson to your daughter, AM. I note in passing as I opened Tommy McKearney's new book (and noted the back cover quote from yourself!) that he notes how he uses Catholic even for agnostics or atheists such as himself as more of a community distinction (akin to the Jewish sense of a people apart from/parallel to religious belief) in his analysis of the North and how distinctions work. One of his critiques, of course, is how the sectarian state post-GFA perpetuates some divisions even as others are claimed to have been overcome....

Good way of dealing with it. Resist the temptation...

2011-06-08T13:07:23.020+01:00

Good way of dealing with it. Resist the temptation to give a confusing answer. Let human contact do the work much more convincingly.

Michaelhenry, nice one! John, Nothing in Aquina...

2011-06-07T20:52:57.203+01:00

Michaelhenry,

nice one!

John,

Nothing in Aquinas that would lead me to change my opinion. When people would rather see gays burn forever in hell rather than accept their life style that is hate no matter what way they dress it up.

Helder Camara was motivated by god but saw him in real people not in some lofty heaven out of human reach. Nor was he a communist but an advocate of social justice. Although the right wing Christian establishment and their military allies labeled him a communist. In his own words 'When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why are they poor, they call me a Communist.'Nelmo Roque Ten Kathen, his biographer, said 'Helder Camara read much in his life, and knew Marxist theory very well but there is nothing in his writings that would allow one to categorize him as a man of the left.'

AM, ‘I find many Christians filled with hate rath...

2011-06-06T23:21:03.299+01:00

AM,

‘I find many Christians filled with hate rather than love.’

Following Aristotle, St Thomas classifies the passions as concupiscible, (love-hatred; desire-abhorrence; joy-sadness) and irascible (hope-despair; courage-fear; anger). These are all good in themselves and are all rooted in love which is the pre-dominant passion. All the others are defined in their relationship to love.

For example; Love is the inclination towards what is seen to be good; hatred is the tending away from what is seen to be evil.

None of the passions are evil in themselves, and are all easily expressed in terms of love (and its counterpart hatred). All of the passions are rooted in love and only lead to evil when they are disordered or used for the wrong object.

‘Christians like Helder Camara are in my experience few and far between.’

Insofar as Helder Camera forgot God and concentrated on an earthly Utopia, he was still motivated by love, but with a disordered object. I would see him more as a Communist than a Christian.

michaelhenry, 'Did God say that the catholic ...

2011-06-06T22:42:35.752+01:00

michaelhenry,

'Did God say that the catholic faith was right'

Yes. Do you not agree it is right? Your religious conviction is just a sham if you do not, much like your Republican convictions.

'and that the priest's should not marry or even get a bit-'

Yes. Matthew 19: 11-12- '[Jesus] said to them: All men take not this word, but they to whom it is given. For there are eunuchs, who were born so from their mother's womb: and there are eunuchs, who were made so by men: and there are eunuchs, who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven. He that can take, let him take it.'

'if we are all made in God's image then he knows that this is a big sacrifice-'

That is the very essence of the priesthood, sacrifice.

John McGirr- Did God say that the catholic faith ...

2011-06-06T22:02:02.298+01:00

John McGirr-

Did God say that the catholic faith was right and that the priest's should not marry or even get a bit- if we are all made in God's image then he knows that this is a big sacrifice-

AM-

" For me it makes no sense whatsoever and i dont need it for anything in life " - you on about religion or genitals-

Michaelhenry, I find many Christians filled with ...

2011-06-06T21:09:20.380+01:00

Michaelhenry,

I find many Christians filled with hate rather than love. Christians like Helder Camara are in my experience few and far between.

A Swedish guy once said to me that religion should...

2011-06-06T19:50:30.183+01:00

A Swedish guy once said to me that religion should be treated like your genitals. I initially thought he meant bollix and agreed instantly. He went on to explain that it is something for your own amusement in private but not to be waved in public. I still agreed! For me it makes no sense whatsoever and I don't need it for anything in life.

michaelhenry, 'if my religion is right- then ...

2011-06-06T18:44:08.545+01:00

michaelhenry,

'if my religion is right- then other religions are wrong- who made that rule up-'

God.

Or what about the 'principle of contradiction'?

If your religion is right and another religion contradicts it, then the latter must be wrong.

If we don't accept that, then human reasoning means nothing. Black can mean white, wet can mean dry, good can mean evil and Sinn Féin can mean Republican.

Sectarianism is a cancer and like a cancer it is n...

2011-06-06T16:05:53.380+01:00

Sectarianism is a cancer and like a cancer it is not always possible to cure it. I would hope that my children will grow up without animosity for others based on religious difference.

Our children begin life like as a blank canvass with no concept of bigotry or hate. The process of socialisation and indoctrination are the brush strokes that form the complex layers of the personality. Children born into a society where there is virulent sectarianism are at risk of developing sectarian attitudes themselves.

As Fionnuala points out; "detachment is not always an option."

AM- One noticeable thing about the way i think of...

2011-06-06T12:25:14.071+01:00

AM-

One noticeable thing about the way i think of different religions-
when a catholic or x catholic makes
remarks against the faith i will argue back with humour- mostly- but if a protestant made the same remarks all i would be thinking is-
bigot-

If religion is good-then why do so many bad evil people support it-
if my religion is right- then other religions are wrong- who made that rule up-

I am catholic- i am christian- i am human- if i am those 3 things then there should be no hate-

Nuala, it is nice that they can. But the real suc...

2011-06-06T10:26:32.574+01:00

Nuala,

it is nice that they can. But the real success would have been detaching her from it while she still lived there. So you are right - detachment is not always an option.

Mackers, It's nice that children can detach th...

2011-06-06T10:11:51.985+01:00

Mackers,
It's nice that children can detach themselves from the world of old hostilities.
Religion has caused more friction that it has ever cured.
I have never had an issue with anyones religion, however, we remain in a statlet rife with sectarianism which means detachment is not always an option.