Comments on The Pensive Quill: Maghaberry And David Ford

Ewok, it is not a question of anyone accusing yo...

2010-06-05T14:14:55.086+01:00

Ewok,

it is not a question of anyone accusing you of hiding your name. You are free to post there without revealing who you are. You make many good points and your contributions are welcome. But if we carry a piece, rather than a comment, I think the author needs to identify themselves. That is why I suggested the dropping of the pen name if you sought to write a piece. You are right about things being in a sad state but this is the fissiparous nature of the republican project. There is no need for you to turn to any group. There are a number of ways that you can back prisoners without aligning yourself to the groups they belong to.

Seán Mór, Anybody there before like ourselves kn...

2010-05-30T08:24:14.512+01:00

Seán Mór,

Anybody there before like ourselves knows what is going in. So ex-prisoners can bring pressure to bear. A genuine concern by many people, and you have touched on it, is the ideological posturing that is going on. It is not only against SF but against others within the republican community who don’t subscribe to this or that bit of republican theology. It will do nothing to protect the prisoners.
Motives matter and I am sure republicans will suspect SF’s. But is the situation of the prisoners worse or better because of SF wading in? I think it can only be better.

Gav,

Gibney and SF can do little but work within the system. SF is a reformist party and has signed up to the legitimacy of the state. But gains should not be rejected because they emanate from within the system. Anything that advances rights has to be viewed in a positive light. The strategic question then is how can these rights be firmly enshrined as rights against the state and not ‘rights’ which are in fact concessions? The problem facing a rights based argument is that the boundaries of what are and are not rights shift subject to political circumstances and constraints.

Nuala,

We know that SF can only go so far given that they have been boxed into the current arrangements. What SF will be willing to support will not satisfy the prisoners. But that was always the way for us when doing time. Martin McGuinness, now operating in Gerry Fitt’s old role, will hardly be able to push the issue any further than Fitt did. The thrust of strategy here should be to extract as much substance as possible from any group’s position. If SF only push it 50% of the way that 50% has to be better than 0 % coming from them. It is my own view that some people abandon the strategic, hope SF do nothing and then on the strength of that increase the tempo of the critique against SF. As far as I am concerned SF can be critiqued from here to eternity but what impact does such a critique, if it becomes the dominant discourse within the pro-prisoner community, have on pushing back prison management?

Ewok, I am not sure how the bin appears. Nuala a...

2010-05-29T09:41:17.395+01:00

Ewok,

I am not sure how the bin appears. Nuala asked about it too so I guess it is there at times and other times not.Its function is to allow you to delete your own comment. It is the only comment you can delete. You can't delete anybody elses.

Nuala, you underlined the problem in one - total...

2010-05-27T21:24:49.769+01:00

Nuala,

you underlined the problem in one - total lack of information. If you could not get to the bottom of the hunger strike issue, and you know Liam's family, what chance had others? It is over now but the situation should not be allowed to develop where prison management forces him to decide that he has no option but to pursue similar action.

Sam, I agree that SF support should be welcomed rather than snubbed. If you rely on the support of the pure at heart alone you will stand alone without much backing. I think a discussion of SF’s motives would be useful but getting support rather than rejecting it is more important to the prisoners position.

Nuala, This unfortunately is the problem. Micky ...

2010-05-26T21:43:49.573+01:00

Nuala,

This unfortunately is the problem. Micky nor any of them will deviate from the line one bit. No matter how much we might like them on a personal level – and I have always liked him and Raymond and Jim Gibney – when it comes to politics they will stick to the line no matter what it is.

Marty, Albert said the same thing?

2010-05-26T18:49:58.188+01:00

Marty, Albert said the same thing?

Big brown envelopes Nuala big brown envelopes

2010-05-26T18:30:44.215+01:00

Big brown envelopes Nuala big brown envelopes

Marty, you are sort of lowering the tone coming ou...

2010-05-26T16:14:36.078+01:00

Marty, you are sort of lowering the tone coming out with stuff like this.
Have people like Mick Hall not taught you any decorum?
How come you never get told off by the blog master?

6FT 5, Nuala and built like a brick shit house, or...

2010-05-26T09:39:44.980+01:00

6FT 5, Nuala and built like a brick shit house, or dunny as"our" Mary the hedgehog would say,the only furry thing about ewok is the stuff he chucks up when the Guinness has been off I bet

yes im a furry little ewok!

2010-05-25T19:57:37.470+01:00

yes im a furry little ewok!

ewok them bins bin hunting me from the start Nual...

2010-05-24T23:33:10.786+01:00

ewok them bins bin hunting me from the start Nuala said Im paranoid and Anthony said it was bin Laden, Nuala calls for a viable alternative to psf, how about Lady ga ga

Ewok, Love the name ewok. Is it after those l...

2010-05-24T21:47:48.836+01:00

Ewok,
Love the name ewok. Is it after those little furry ewoks out of Star Wars?

I remember a few years ago Tommy Mc Kearney calling or rather suggesting that what was needed was one "viable opposition to Sinn Fein"
Unfortunately as you say republicanism is splintered into so many factions.

Someone recently wrote in the paper they felt prisoners were being let down by Coiste. They suggested that, there should be one independent prisoners group.
If one were to emerge now, it would be perfectly timed.

whats the story with the bin by my comment,is that...

2010-05-24T21:25:41.723+01:00

whats the story with the bin by my comment,is that a hint?

Am,when i posted for the first time,it just automa...

2010-05-24T21:19:23.076+01:00

Am,when i posted for the first time,it just automatically chose the name ewok,im not hiding,my name is john.you suggested writing a 'piece' im not really the article writing type. ya i believe the hannaway issue needs a lot of discussion.if the man dies we'll all be discussing it. i believe the various republican groups have been caught off guard and have so far offered a poor response to the crisis in terms of all the prisoners,we dont even hear much of michael campbell anymore,i think he's still captive in a lithuanian shit hole.why there cant be a united prisoners movement at least is sadening,as an independent im not sure who to turn too,there was a demo in cork last week for the prisoners,32csm,rsf had banners etc,there has been a split recently in rsf,the limerick and mallow branches left en masse apparently over what i dont know. as an independent i'd love to row in behind the prisoners but others have expressed the view that some groups wouldnt be happy with non aligned people speaking for their prisoners,what a sad state of afairs indeed.i believe the way the screws are treating the boys is part of a wider campaign against 'the dissidents',i think they are testing the resolve of this generation of prisoners,and republicans in general.not sure if generation is right word there but you know what i mean.

Ewok, I think you are right for flagging the issue...

2010-05-24T20:57:45.785+01:00

Ewok, I think you are right for flagging the issue up. And the suggestion that you drop anonymity is merely to allow you the facility to put something out there. I think comments without an ID are alright although I never prefer the use of anonymity. But I feel for a piece to go out it would have to be without anonymity. The situation Liam Hannaway finds himself in deserves wider discussion.

thanks to all who answered,sorry if it came across...

2010-05-24T20:22:23.011+01:00

thanks to all who answered,sorry if it came across as though i was saying you were ignoring it,i know you were'nt,its a very sad situation indeed,not sure dropping my anonymity would matter much,im an independent republican from cork just quite concerned about it is all, i looked it up as much as i could,seems he's on hunger strike in the same manner as gary donnelly was,i would imagine the screws are playing it up because he's a cousin of adams,by that i mean they would easily let the man die,i rekon there is a despicable breed of screws running that prison right now.on one blog there was a lot of talk about expulsion from the 'contos' that he had no support from them,but others seemed to think he would be welcomed onto 'roe house'i believe his hunger strike is definetly against the conditions he's being held in,similar to that of the man who committed suicide awhile back(which was apparently the source of the 'industrial dispute'between screws and management),anyway i hope the man doesnt die,whatever his situation,republican intricacies aside he's part of the same struggle thomas ashe was.tha struggle goes on.

Mackers, Albert has always said good about him. (...

2010-05-24T16:23:42.029+01:00

Mackers,
Albert has always said good about him. (apart from the arrogant bit) However I know people who went to one of the meeting he held. These women went with purely altrustic intentions, seeking help for other ex-prisoners, they said he spoke to them like dirt.

Regarding yourself and Tommy I would guess he would know better.
I just think, he is like the rest of the shinners self seeking and self serving.

If I am wrong about him Mackers, I will profusely apologise!
In public on "The Pensive Quill"

Nuala, Micky bought me and Tommy Gorman a pint o...

2010-05-24T11:30:26.970+01:00

Nuala,

Micky bought me and Tommy Gorman a pint one night! Regardless of the politics and the shortcomings I have always liked him.

Hedgeing their bets Nuala, or waiting to see which...

2010-05-24T00:37:36.484+01:00

Hedgeing their bets Nuala, or waiting to see which wy the wind blows, they are politicos after all

Fionnuala, you're right, it was probably wrong...

2010-05-23T21:45:26.954+01:00

Fionnuala, you're right, it was probably wrong of me to suggest that PSF motives don't really matter. Motives may effect outcome, so they are important to a certain extent.

At the same time, I do feel that some people are excessively fixated with PSF motives...

The important thing is the prisoners, their protest, and the improvement of their conditions...

Sean, disagree with you that Sinn Fein's motiv...

2010-05-23T21:14:29.965+01:00

Sean, disagree with you that Sinn Fein's motives are unimportant.
Considering motives are usually the driving force that dictates action. I think their motives for going into the prison are extremely important.

If their motives were superficial or half baked. Well then, it would follow that any actions produced will also be superficial and half baked.

However, if their motives for going in to the prison were out of genuine concern for prisoners then, the end result should be very productive.

Since they went in there has been no statement from themselves or their party leader!
Which leaves us all wondering about their motives!

Very informative piece Mackers. By any standards, ...

2010-05-23T20:01:03.753+01:00

Very informative piece Mackers. By any standards, relentless strip searching, 23 hour lock-up, and excessively intensive controlled movement is an oppressive regime when endured every day in such a confined space. The British prison 'service' in Ireland is probably once of the most reactionary elements left of the system. This type of treatment would probably stir a protest from prisoners convicted of social crimes, never mind from political prisoners who should be granted more political conditions in my view.

I think the protest outside the prison and the various white-line pickets have helped to highlight the problem, and a lot of people are certainly aware of 'something not being right', and it is now a topic of discussion in local communities.

It remains to be seen whether that can be channelled into an effective campaign to resolve the matter and restore dignity, space and basic human rights to republican political prisoners. Maybe the recent publicity on its own might be enough to trigger a resolution, although this might be a bit over-optimistic given that, as you pointed out, the local British Justice Minister didn't even meet with the people most affected by the regime. He only met the regime.

As regards PSF involvement and their motives; the motives don't really matter. What matters is that the issue gets resolved. During the hungerstrikes we may have been suspicious of many of those involved from different political backgrounds, but all efforts were made to gather as much support as possible from as many sources as possible.

Mackers: I agree that the PSF position is purely s...

2010-05-23T19:30:21.306+01:00

Mackers: I agree that the PSF position is purely strategic and ultimately geared towards harnessing and controlling any momentum derived from the prison protest. Gibney's article displays the essence of this where he criticises the abuses and manipulation of the system by staff on the one hand and praises the receptiveness of the prison management on the other. It's obvious that any efforts on their part will be from within the system and any progress will be at the whim of the system. It will be interested to see whether sense, malice or indifference will prevail.

Excuse me Anthony I meant to say in my last post, ...

2010-05-23T16:31:07.336+01:00

Excuse me Anthony I meant to say in my last post, that Adams has been such a sweet boy all his life,he wouldnt have any experience of drink or drugs so therefore he,d be useless at the coalface, and if I saw his mates coming up my path I wouldnt wait to find out what help they were gonna offer me, I like my bones just the way they are I,d run like fuck

I take it then Nuala that Adams himself will have ...

2010-05-23T14:38:43.683+01:00

I take it then Nuala that Adams himself will have nothing to do with the "befrienders" as the man has said himself,(I use the term man loosley)that he never was in anything and therefore could,nt have any coalface experience, as for being a republican ,fucking dont make me laugh I,m holding a mug of tea, Stormont stooge yes rep na!he could of course give hints on eating the alter rails, lying with a straight face, and licking brit ass.still waiting to hear from him and his cronies about Liam Hannaway and the other men in Maghaberry