Comments on The Pensive Quill: Culpability Not Absolved

Mick It will continue to be an ongoing problem a...

2011-07-04T18:52:48.913+01:00

Mick

It will continue to be an ongoing problem and not just in the UK. And in every society some children will continue to be valued more than others and quite often it will be their parents doing the devaluing. I have just not bought into the perspective that the social workers should be absolved of their responsibility in the case of Baby P. They were not alone but that makes their guilt shared and not absolved; hence the title of the article. Shoesmith was hounded by the Sun and made into a hate figure. This was wrong but it does nothing to mitigate her role and responsibility.

AM The problem with this case despite all the bro...

2011-07-02T11:43:07.796+01:00

AM

The problem with this case despite all the brouhaha and the way it was dealt with by the MSM and Balls, etc, bar Shoesmith and a few of her social workers, those who also had a responsibility to report this child's mistreatment did wander through these things without accountability or sanction.

When the media and leading politicians are able to place all responsibility on social workers, it absolves them from 'blame' and responsibility in the public mind and the world moves on.

Yes the child in this case should have been taken into care, that is self evedent and Shoesmith as the head of the deprtment should have shouldered 'some' of the blame, likewise the government minister and a number of other people down the food chain.

But unless we look at the bigger picture, as you say this is and will continue to be an ongoing problem.

We all must take a degree of responsibility and question why the UK has such an appalling record in this field. It is not rocket science in this class prejudice swamp, some children are undoubtedly more valued by this society than others.

I could go on but you understand all this, as I have said before if you put shit in one end it is liable to come out the other.

This issue is one of many which demonstrates what a ridiculous topsy-turvy society we live in. Those who most castigate social workers for their shortcomings on this issue, are also the first to demand they are given more powers which will enable them to take kids into care at the drop of a hat.

Funny old world, just another step back towards the 19th century type society the coalition wishes to recreate.

Mick ‘Blame and punishment is what we demand, not...

2011-07-02T07:20:53.696+01:00

Mick

‘Blame and punishment is what we demand, not coolly looking at responsibility and how a similar tragedy can be avoided.’

Yet if people can wander through these things without accountability the situation will not get any better.

‘These days no one in a powerful position takes responsibility for anything that goes wrong on their watch, yet we demand social workers take the rap for what society as a whole should be taking care of.’

I don’t think this captures what is happening. Social workers are being asked to take responsibility for what they inexcusably failed to see, not for the systemic problems that this issue brought to the fore.

Nuala ,

‘The failings in Baby P's case were so pronounced that you have to wonder were the people from social services turning up at the house with dark glasses and white sticks.’

This is precisely it.

Mick , ‘Problems arise because the case loads of ...

2011-07-01T21:20:56.122+01:00

Mick ,

‘Problems arise because the case loads of the average social worker are so great they are unmanageable.’

Undoubtedly. But not in this case. It was so plain to see.

‘Sacking Shoesmith in the manner Balls did was outrageous, yes she must shoulder some of the responsibility for what occurred.’

Procedurally, yes. But she deserved to go.

‘I would guess in her working life she has done more to protect children at risk than many of her critics.’

Many pilots have safely landed more planes than many of their critics but that is what they are supposed to do. It is when they crash the planes they are supposed to land that they get the flak.

‘it is only a matter of time before another Baby P emerges.’

I would be certain it has happened already and more than once.

Fionnchú

I wonder if it provides the same titillation for readers as the Penny Dreadfuls once did

Helen ‘IMO I see nothing wrong in holding case w...

2011-07-01T09:55:12.415+01:00

Helen

‘IMO I see nothing wrong in holding case workers and their Agencies totally accountable if a child falls through the cracks on their watch due to incompetence, indifference or neglect of their responsibilities.’

It would seem the right thing to do. Consider the consequences of not holding them accountable.

SMH,

‘The good old conversion to God in jail number by offenders is as old as child abuse itself ain't it’

It is indeed. It provides comfort to people in a stressful situation. It becomes a problem when they start proselytising and preaching. I have seen them. Religion just cannot mind its own business.

Nuala

‘It is not feasible or believable that no signs of abuse were noted by social workers over a protracted series of home visits.’

This is where the case in defence of social workers collapses. The blind could have seen something was wrong.

All: Very sad and embarrassed to say that this typ...

2011-06-28T05:52:07.182+01:00

All:
Very sad and embarrassed to say that this type of child abuse is a common happening in the USA and regardless of all the policies and procedures put in place to avoid such outcomes, too many children are still dying horrific deaths at the hands of their mothers and their boyfriends. The system put in place to protect children is broken and it is not getting better. The government continues to cut funding to these vital services and there are not enough social workers to handle all of the cases they are given to oversee; not to mention I believe that there are some working in social services who are not qualified to do the job or they have been in the position too long and have become indifferent to it.

IMO I see nothing wrong in holding case workers and their Agencies totally accountable if a child falls through the cracks on their watch due to incompetence, indifference or neglect of their responsibilities. In some of these tragic cases you hear about in the media, it appears from the time DYFS is alerted to a possible child abuse situation to the time they respond, the child is already in critical condition? Most child abuse cases in the USA appear to be drug related as the mother and husband, or mother and boyfriend are drug addicts. In some cases it stems from vile and sadistic behavior on the part of the mother and/or her boyfriend. I totally agree with Fionnuala and SMH that any child in danger should be placed in protective care until totally sorted out in the best interest of the child.

Saint?Maryhedgehog, I think it takes very special ...

2011-06-22T22:55:21.751+01:00

Saint?Maryhedgehog,
I think it takes very special people to provide that type of care.
I think those children are so fortunate that they have people like yourself and many others to do that work.

SMH Thanks for your replies they have been inform...

2011-06-22T10:57:48.409+01:00

SMH

Thanks for your replies they have been informative and invigorating.

Take care

Mick

@ Mick RE: ‘We should also consider like many peo...

2011-06-22T04:57:42.729+01:00

@ Mick RE: ‘We should also consider like many people who have been in care, that person is liable to suffer from rejection and maybe from low self esteem for the rest of their lives. It is no accident a large number of homeless and jailed young people have been in care.’
True but I also think human beings are strong and can fight through to higher ground – it is calling that up in individuals and assisting them to call it up within themselves & run with it - that be the challenge. There will imo be always residual damage from deep, searing childhood losses/abuse including rejection/not knowing who ones biological parents are. The correlation between suicides, addiction, self harm, domestic violence, general dysfunction, incaceration and mental health illnesses stemming from child abuse is a definite, strong one. It never fails to stab my heart when an older man or woman who have lived hard cry when sharing their childhood of abuse. I am talking authentic disclosure not the sob story mode to get off a charge or elicit pity to score something.. U know the real deal stuff... The crying always sounds childlike – one is let into sacred ground of the deepest pain... There is ENORMOUS, often unresolved grief underpinning the childlike cries...
There are studies done which you probably know about, re the plasticity of the brain. Child abuse trauma screws the synapses in developing brains The scars are always there in physical and emotional sense but the brain can build new pathways...

@ Fionnuala I salute all who provide a family home environment for abused kids and love them to bits... Decades ago I fostered a young one as no home could be found & institutionalization would have been the end of this little ones sanity.. . It was gruelling as high trauma present – one of the doctors said call us if it gets too much & you need more help! I never did but i learnt why he said that!! One little eye used to open and watch me to ensure i was still there... Piercing roars of rage when i disappeared to have a wee or answer the phone! Round the clock it was that little eye periodically opening to see if I was there! I went from being a cool looking, trendy woman to wearing trackpants sometimes pulled on over pjs so could rush to corner shop for milk, unbrushed hair, no time for anything but totally absorbed in childcare & singing kids toons over & over like a mantra. The little one thrived! My best friend with a young kid she laughed her guts out at how i looked. Good news is i eventually found a brilliant home for the little one which was also culturally appropriate. (i cried saying goodbye cos you bond..,) then i rushed home and smoked countless fags (cannot do that round kids) and cranked the music up full tilt... and for a long while I missed that little ones eye opening up to watch me... ! Caring for kids who have been abused is fullon work and I admire those who do. The reward is seeing the kids slowly settle... One always hopes the damage will not dictate a destructive lifestyle/choices... ALWAYS the hope...

Saint?MaryHedgehog, My friend has provided a safe ...

2011-06-21T15:38:41.630+01:00

Saint?MaryHedgehog,
My friend has provided a safe haven for abused and neglected children for years.
I have seen first hand the absolutely remarkable job she does easing hurt and providing genuine love and affection.
Children may or might not love their abusive parents. I know they will cover for them, but that would probably be an act of fear than unconditional love or loyalty.
The failings in Baby P's case were so pronounced that you have to wonder were the people from social services turning up at the house with dark glasses and whitesticks.
Was the doctor who examined him intoxicated and just downright neglectful?
Blame game, it should have been a shame game, everyone remotely connected with the case should have been sacked and then prosecuted.

SMH I tend to agree with what you have written, j...

2011-06-21T14:08:13.988+01:00

SMH

I tend to agree with what you have written, just to be clear I never send baby P should not have been placed in care, what I questioned was placing a child in care should be the first option.

Leaving babies aside for one moment, the feelings of the child must also be taken into account. Believe it or not, abused children can and do love their parents and once a child goes into the system after being abused, it takes a brave social worker to recommend they return to the family.

We should also consider like many people who have been in care, that person is liable to suffer from rejection and maybe from low self esteem for the rest of their lives. It is no accident a large number of homeless and jailed young people have been in care. Even the best care homes and foster carriers turn a child out at 18, some younger. Is their a more wicked way to tell a teenager in this society your not valued?

You struck the nail on the head when you mentioned 'the blame' game, for that is what the MSM and society demands when a Baby P type case arises. Blame and punishment is what we demand, not cooly looking at responsibility and how a similar tragedy can be avoided.

This atmosphere inevitable leads to cover up as who wants to be publicly pilloried and hung out to dry, far better to lie or keep your head down.

These days no one in a powerful position takes responsibility for anything that goes wrong on their watch, yet we demand social workers take the rap for what society as a whole should be taking care of.

You write, NEVER rely on social services or authorities and in many cases that is good advice.
However some people do not have anyone to rely on and have little alternative but to turn to these bodies,

Yes as you say we all have a responsibility to look out for each other, but in turn when things slip by us we should not put all of societies ills of social workers and local councils.

Where there is child abuse in the home there is in...

2011-06-21T11:00:51.416+01:00

Where there is child abuse in the home there is invariably an adult enabler of it... Very common for a partner to allow it to occur. The child or baby becomes the 'sacrificial lamb' Sometimes the Mother gets off on it all - perverted mode. Them the facts... Working in social work rips away any belief a Mother will die for her child or baby to protect them from harm... I have seen the look of i am gonna make a difference for the kids fade very quickly from fresh outta University into social work students eyes... when they realise this...

@ Anthony The good old conversion to God in jail number by offenders is as old as child abuse itself ain't it... Who weeps when the screws turn a blind eye and the immates take a child abuse offender out... No-one... I am very dubious re. all jail conversions. Strange how banged up inside brings a stream of sudden enlightenment & remorse for atrocities. How come it did not happen prior...

@ Mick Baby P should have been placed in care End of story imo. Ironically a death or abuse in care in our era would recieve more investigation & reporting as more closely monitored than a child or baby at possible risk in family home. Children are at risk in all environments because sick individuals are everywhere... I have never believed the biological family blather one gets taught... It has a place in intervention but should never dictate it. It is not feasible or believable that no signs of abuse were noted by social workers over a protracted series of home visits. It is a cover up of monumental proportions and blame shifting games. The case loads in child abuse prevention/intervention are ridiculous and the shaving down of services is only going to get worse... How it all be worldwide in social services.

@ Fionnchu Article was very well written and dead on imo. Hard to read tho as so hideous in parts... Tiger Tiger will be the jerk off manual for future pedo's. Survivors of abuse should never detail graphics or insights in public access way - books etc. Perhaps the author misguided thinking it would free her from the past but I am more inclined to think she wanted $$. The salivating sickos will be delighted with the book...

Word! We ALL collectively and individually are responsible for protecting little ones day in day out whether they are ours or others. In care, in the home and so on... Watch, observe, look & listen... and take action the minute you see something not right. NEVER rely on social services or authorities.

@ Fionnuala yes i remember my lst case of family abuse of a minor... I couldnt sleep for days after working with family doing interventions stuff... One of the kids clung to me like i was a liferaft.. Heartbreaking to the core. I was 22 then and felt like i was 100 years old. I did a year of that sort of work and decided Never Again. It be not an easy field to work in. I dont think Jesus face be soaked with tears but rage I hope Jesus has a loaded gun for the perps. in next life.

I happened to read this link just before your own ...

2011-06-19T23:11:34.470+01:00

I happened to read this link just before your own piece, AM. It's by a family friend who's a novelist about often disturbing, taboo subjects. The Pervert's Point-of-View. She examines why the attraction to abuse memoirs by victims persists as a sort of readable "reality t.v." today.

Mick, Baby P may have survived if he had been pla...

2011-06-19T22:25:34.112+01:00

Mick,
Baby P may have survived if he had been placed in care.
That logic of keeping children in the 'natural' family unit in spite of evidence to support danger has been proven as misplaced and flawed.
Society cannot take risks with children, if there is as much as a whimper of wrong doing in a household, then the child should be removed until the issue is fully investigated and prperly dealt with.
Children are more at risk in their own homes and from their own 'natural' family than anywhere else.
I think that fact alone makes a nonsense of the ideals that underpin social care thinking.

When ever these unnecessary tragedies occur, there...

2011-06-19T19:02:07.847+01:00

When ever these unnecessary tragedies occur, there is a rush by the MSM media to put pressure on those with authority to scapegoat a few individuals and move on.

Social workers are rightly taught that a child is best placed with its natural family, even though that family may be less than perfect.

What should they do, take a chance with a family and hope it can be 'managed', or send the kid into care, where in all probability they may be bullied and at worse buggered by the creep who should be protecting them. THESE THINGS STILL HAPPEN. Problems arise because the case loads of the average social worker are so great they are unmanageable.

Yet almost every council in England today has a policy of not recruiting 'new' social workers to take up this slack. This may seem hard to believe given the brouhaha over Baby P, but if you doubt me check out the Society section of the Guardian, it used to be full of public sector jobs now there are hardly any.

If government makes cut backs in public services, it is the weakest who take the hit and I doubt there are many more powerless than children in need.

Sacking Shoesmith in the manner Balls did was outrageous, yes she must shoulder some of the responsibility for what occurred. Her and many others that is, but she did not kill this child, indeed I would guess in her working life she has done more to protect children at risk than many of her critics.

Unless we all start recognising we live in society were the week and powerless go to the wall and place the blame squarely where it lays for this, it is only a matter of time before another Baby P emerges, or an elderly pensioner will die a lonely death for lack of heat and food.

Nuala, it was sheer raw emotion writing at the ti...

2011-06-19T18:17:41.771+01:00

Nuala,

it was sheer raw emotion writing at the time.

Vermin is an apt term for the people in that house of horrors. The mother was no better. A proper 'Mommy Dreadful.' It was the defencelessness of the child who endured a veritable hell.

I recall the case you are talking about. The thug was a missionary from Portadown, Geoffrey Briggs, who used his position to bamboozle Romanian authorities (not that the checks were stringent). How that brute managed to get away with only a year jail sentence defies reason. And then he never faced a murder charge for the child that got battered to death. Terrible case.

Mackers, several years ago a Romanian baby was kil...

2011-06-19T16:21:50.363+01:00

Mackers,
several years ago a Romanian baby was killed here by an adoptive parent.
The child a twin, was apparently covered in bruises and multiple fractures which the state pathologist missed!
The horror behind these children's lives only came to light several months later when the second twin was admitted to hospital with serious injuries to the face.
At the time, a family support worker was suspended from her job for not keeping a truthful account about the care the children were receiving.
No doubt she too will be reinstated and receive hefty compensation.

Mackers, just read your former piece on Baby P, un...

2011-06-19T15:18:49.296+01:00

Mackers,
just read your former piece on Baby P, unbelievable how you can capture emotions that we all struggle to express.
Your are so right, that our minds do not want to retreat into such thoughts.
Anger, sickness, sadness, shame does not even come close, a person's head just wants to shut it out.
As I said earlier Mackers, I never read it before, I simply could not bear to read it.
Once I had to force myself to sit and listen to two women shouting the gory details to each other across a packed hairdressers. Thankfully, hairdryers and other ongoing conversations drowned out most of what was being shouted.
I totally appreciate the fact that social wokers should not totally bear the brunt for these horrors.
However, I think unless they remove the acceptable level and replace it with zero tolerance, creatures like the vermin in this case will always have scope to prey on children.

Nuala, I first wrote about this a few years ago. ...

2011-06-19T14:48:37.791+01:00

Nuala,

I first wrote about this a few years ago. It was both terrible and terrifying. I found it very hard to read. At one point we even planned on going to the London protest I felt so angry about it.

http://thepensivequill.am/2008/12/lava.html

What you say about the real attitude within the social services seems so true. I think it unfair that the social workers be blamed exclusively but in the case of Baby P they deserved serious criticism.

Mackers, this is the first I have actually read wh...

2011-06-19T13:48:57.211+01:00

Mackers,
this is the first I have actually read what happened to baby P.
I know the papers were saturated with the story for weeks when he died but I could never bring myself to read it.
Reading this today, just leaves a person with an appalling sense of helplessness and hopelessness.
The very idea of someone actively setting out to torment and torture a child presents the normal mind with a dilemma beyond comprehnesion.
My first experience of child abuse was when I worked for a Doctor many, many years ago.
It was also my first rude awakening as to how unprofessional the appointed professionals can be at dealing with this type of crime.
Having spent a considerable amount of time on social work and social care courses it became increasingly apparent that, there is a tolerance threshold that allows for an acceptable level of abuse.
Social workers are taught that a child is best placed with its natural family, even though that family may be less than perfect.
What this basically translates to is, keep an eye but its also okay to look the other way.
If the face of Jesus is anywhere in this appalling tale it must be soaked with tears.

Marty, the so called mother was a low life as wel...

2011-06-19T12:05:51.493+01:00

Marty,

the so called mother was a low life as well.

http://thepensivequill.am/2008/11/mommy-dreadful.html

Heartbreaking Anthony all involved should hang the...

2011-06-19T11:50:44.328+01:00

Heartbreaking Anthony all involved should hang their heads in shame, as for the bastard who inflicted such cruelty to that child ,he should be given an OBE yip one behind the ear.