Comments on The Pensive Quill: Wiki-Dump

Marty, it is not my job to try and make the NUJ a...

2013-04-13T10:32:52.652+01:00

Marty,

it is not my job to try and make the NUJ an old boys and grand girls club that wants the right to scrutinise others but to pull down the shutters when its own are probed. Journalists of all people complaining about being slagged off! People must have the right to offend journalists. The journalists concerned should have taken the criticism on the chin and come out fighting as journalists rather than opting for the censorship route which ultimately defeats journalism. But if you look at the way the union folded in relation to Leveson, it has lost sight of its purpose.

Mark pulled his piece because he didn't have the means to fight a case. The big institution was set to crush the individual. In our case it wouldn't matter who applied what sanction: courts, unions or whoever - there was not one red cent going their way.

Anthony I love it when the system and especially i...

2013-04-13T09:25:57.300+01:00

Anthony I love it when the system and especially its lackeys score an own goal, your case in mind, I to would love them to come here and comment the lads from the uvf have done so and proved themselves to have balls and capability sadly lacking in the two wankers who have tried to hide their mis-practice by silencing yourself,I was disappointed Mark pulled his piece, I would have hoped that enough people would have supported his case if it was needed.anyway it gladdens my heart to read that their attempt at censorship has not just failed but failed miserably,as Larry would say slap it up the bastards...

Marty, I have been surprised at the amount of pag...

2013-04-13T07:35:18.558+01:00

Marty,

I have been surprised at the amount of page reads this has taken. How much people read is another matter as there is a lot there. But it has taken about ten times the page hits that the piece they complained about took. Which means what they did not want out is out even more. Sort of makes you wonder about the point of it all. I have long been determined that censorship would not work. That has been the beauty of the net I guess. And since reading Steve Biko in the early 1980s I have been impressed with his Frank Talk column. He would write a column under that by line and called it I write what I like It so annoyed the authorities that it was one of the reasons they ultimately murdered him. The censorious mind does not like people writing what they like.

Itsjustmacker,

one reason they chose not to respond on the blog I imagine is that they wanted the thing suppressed not discussed. And we had to thwart that. I am pleasantly surprised by the response we have got from this wiki-dump and also from Ed's piece. There is a considerably wider understanding of the issues now.

Anthony: It is obvious as to why they wont post o...

2013-04-13T01:21:03.629+01:00

Anthony:

It is obvious as to why they wont post on the TPQ , They would have been told by the Editor, "NOT TO".

But I bet they would love to post on the TPQ, but have to accept The Editors decision, otherwise they would be putting there own feet in there own mouths.

Why not offer them the opportunity to reply to all the posters on TPQ.

Its not a journalistic offence!.

Marty:

As for "Chaple", I was wondering if they were all "Friar Tucks".

wiki tries to give a definition of the word Chaple, makes you wonder if its a pope or paisley writing on it.

meaning of chaple

Anthony slowly working my way through this , can y...

2013-04-12T21:04:06.361+01:00

Anthony slowly working my way through this , can you tell me is this why they use the name chapel is it like a church thing where the innocent get fucked? hoping the NUJ take offence.

Niall, FFS. I know.

2013-04-09T16:01:33.759+01:00

Niall,

FFS. I know.

AM I read Moloney's article on the above and t...

2013-04-09T15:36:23.052+01:00

AM
I read Moloney's article on the above and the behaviour of the two journalists leaves me to conclude that there are very few Mr Fisks left in the world of journalism......liked the igloo metaphor though!!!!!

This is from Sean McAughey The Belf...

2013-03-30T15:25:37.027Z

This is from Sean McAughey

The Belfast Project Boston College, like similar projects has removed the so called whim utilization of the national security clause and what most right thinking journalists of integrity ought to regard as a complete censorship by the few over the purest here and now, public interest. The above project has subverted the 30 years ruling that in reality seeks to protect the interest of the few always under the guise of protecting National interest. Surely, the journalistic code of ethics is based on a code of practice that seeks to report fairly and accurately any and all matters that are in the public interest.

An investigative journalist I admire once told me “never to put down to conspiracy what sheer incompetence might cover”. This advice would remain with me as a level approach and a formula for most issues. However, the recent NUJ decision “about” but clearly without, Anthony McIntyre does conjure much incompetence but much more shafting. Yet, not enough egomania to exclude the sense of invisible hands at work with a clear enough agenda. Get Mackers, defame Mackers and to use any journalistic or other means to scupper the Belfast Boston project and especially Mackers’ “standing in the community” sometimes called reputation.

The NUJ internal dealing of this matter stinks of a Jeremy Kyle show that has gone horribly wrong. The affair ought to fully reflect on mainstream newspaper mogul power and control, headlines that sell and other interests beyond the integrity of all of the individual journalists as being adhered to as paramount in this instance.

The further questionable outcome from the NUJ “hearing” that was not a hearing or indeed a not disciplinary hearing that could still reach and deliver, a disciplinary decision and a trades’ union membership sanction against Anthony McIntyre clearly projects less trades union justice than a firing squad. Furthermore it does not satisfactory address what we can only now assume to be the single core NUJ membership internal issue.

Anthony McIntyre’s standing in the community is one of a prime advocate for the voiceless at all times. Most serious journalists, trade union leaders and human right defenders if not already personally indebted to him. Then more than likely desire to emulate the man’s integrity and courage to speak out and speak up when others remained silent and idle. However, I also feel obliged to emphasize that there has been many times previous when the other specific individual journalists embroiled in this spiralling matter have also stepped up to the mark for the voiceless with equal fervour, integrity and courage.

It is never a good public interest story when good journalists are writing about how good journalists are now bad. This theme seems to permeate the new peace and its new way in all aspects. It is vicious circle that good journalists ought to serve as an intervention for freedom of press and freedom of expression and not the conduit of perpetuating the spin from the few. The NUJ ethics committee have much explaining to do. Let them like many others have done so for years utilize the courtesy of your open forum to do so.

Slan go foill

Sean McAughey

I think most people accept 'news headlines'...

2013-03-30T14:01:38.409Z

I think most people accept 'news headlines' are mere spin these days. We have become experts at looking beyond the sanctioned/self censored crap that's spouted out at us to make up our own minds about what is really going on. Just yet another result of our experiences with the media during the troubles. What we are fed today is a shameless insult to basic inteligence and below anyone with an O'Level.

The icing on the cake or 'jewel in the crown' is that even today, a decade after the Iraq war and the WMD crap, so called respected journalists (sic) insist Tony Blair wasn't telling lies, he believed what he was saying and even missled himself...Are these people paid for this endless shit? Bankers, or a similar word does somewhat spring to mind!

Frankie, It is the big institution up against the...

2013-03-29T14:22:56.405Z

Frankie,

It is the big institution up against the individual.

Let the information flow rather than suppress it. After that the truth should be able to find its own level. Why can the Irish News not allow the accounts challenging its narrative to be out there and in turn deconstruct it?

But it matters not what the Irish News does because while I refuse to allow it to dictate the discourse then it has to live with the consequences. It simply does not have the power to censor me. It can run to the Ethics Council, it can wax outraged in its editorials, it can issue court proceedings, it can even seek to jail me. Last time I was in jail they hadn't banned pens and even when they did during the blanket protest we still got them and wrote. So even if they managed to commit me to prison I will still write from jail and offer a different account of the role of the Irish News. So, again, what can the Irish News do?

I wish it had never come to this but it has so I am going to stand up and fight.

And Michael Henry's post confirms my belief (t...

2013-03-29T13:58:29.326Z

And Michael Henry's post confirms my belief (that's it's an early Aprils fools). Just how often do either Anthony or Michael agree? Putting the technology stuff, man power etc to oneside.

I've to believe the Irish News are trying to censor an ex blanket man. Even from my limited knowledge, even I know the might of the British Empire couldn't censor blanketmen.

Anthony, if it's not an early Aprils fools. Then Allison has had blonde moment

Michaelhenry, nobody here going to be deterred by...

2013-03-29T13:47:32.107Z

Michaelhenry,

nobody here going to be deterred by the Irish News.

I agree with you that the journalists should respond and they will always be afforded the right to reply.

The problem is that they don't want people replying to them. They seek the right to have their statements published and comments closed.
Moreover, there is snobbishness towards bloggers. It is the journalistic caste system where at the top there is the staffers, the freelancers are beneath them and the bloggers are the untouchables.

Allison Morris in her own column (as cited above) tries to wax disdainful of bloggers but then sets out to have blogs censured. I don’t know if it applies here but many journalists have their nose put out of joint by the fact that often at blog level the ‘amateur’ is capable of better writing than the ‘professional’.
But ultimately it does not work. I guarantee you that since the Ethics Council verdict more people have been made aware of the allegations against Morris/Barnes/Irish News than were aware from before the verdict. It does not mean that the allegations are true. But they are now being discussed which is something the other side never wanted, It sought to smother that discussion.

Even from a strategic point of view you would imagine that it would be a matter of common sense not to address what you regard as an alcohol problem by providing more beer.

What has the other side achieved? More publicity for something about which they sought less publicity.

What has the Ethics Council achieved? Nothing other than to be confirmed at the end of all this as the bastion of journalistic wankerdom I accuse it of being. It can't silence me, its sanction is meaningless in terms of what I write or permit others to write and ultimately the Ethics Council lying is a hard one to defend on ethical grounds.

The Ethics Council can only succeed when those it seeks to bully are afraid of the sanction. So after 18 years in Brit jails am I supposed to quake in my boots at the six month suspension handed down from English toffs? Hardly likely.

AM- You have made your views known on the Irish n...

2013-03-29T13:04:53.372Z

AM-

You have made your views known on the Irish news-you would think that
one of those reporters or editor would reciprocate with a comment to explain themselves [if they can ]on a open forum like the Quill-i know they have a paper to write on but if it was good enough to snitch on you at least they can do is put their story on here-

A few years ago when bloggers put their pictures on blogs the reporters copied this and started to put there own mugs on there reports in the papers-they might not respond to a blog but they will read it-and might copy the odd
one-

Hope no one stops writing comments on here because the All mighty Irish news opposed you-

Nuala, I know why the Irish News is doing what it...

2013-03-29T11:38:36.833Z

Nuala,

I know why the Irish News is doing what it is doing. There is absolutely no personal animosity between me and the people who work at the paper in whatever capacity from editor down. There is, however, a fundamental clash of perspectives. This is about issues that go to the heart of what the paper's role was in this matter. I want it all out in the public domain and the other side does not. So it has made a futile attempt to thwart me and silence the people I was giving a voice to. FFS, how often has that failed in the past? The Irish News under its current editor actually published me in October 2000 after the killing of Joe O’Connor when I refused along with Tommy Gorman to be silenced by Sinn Fein and the IRA. So it knows trying to gag me legally or otherwise is a waste of time.

The paper and its journalists have every right to make their case. That I think it lacks standing is neither here nor there. But we all have the right to a fair hearing which I most certainly did not get from the Ethics Council. It lied to myself and my solicitor from the first point of contact on the day of the pseudo hearing.

But you are right, the paper took on what it thought to be the easiest target and probably believed it would get endorsement from an institution like the Ethics Council although I don’t hold the Irish News responsible for the deception and ineptitude of the Ethics Council.
If I thought I was wrong on this issue and had behaved improperly and caused unnecessary harm it would not cost me a thought to lift the phone to Allison, Ciaran or Noel and say 'mea culpa' and issue a public statement to that effect. But I would be wrong to do that when I think I am in the right on this matter.

If over the course of time the other side produce material that would lead me to rethink and change my mind I will do so. We have put out all the correspondence and documentation so that people can make up their own minds. If the other side have anything to add to that they should go for it.

Ethics and journalism does not always go hand and ...

2013-03-29T11:11:47.575Z

Ethics and journalism does not always go hand and hand.. The Irish News editor and journalists are protective of some whilst quite disturbingly happy to throw others to the wolves. Honest opinion is stifled and the status quo promoted about all else.

In the spirit of the GFA (all things being (equal)...

2013-03-29T11:07:57.936Z

In the spirit of the GFA (all things being (equal). I see Billy Hutchinson is being sued for plagiarism.

"If I am interviewed by one journalist and researcher about my life and tell them about my experiences and then interviewed a number of years later what I say is always going to be very similar. How on earth can she claim my life experiences and story are her intellectual property or for that matter how does the back story of loyalism become the property of any one particular journalist, researcher or author?"

Frankie, I think the proof of the pudding is in t...

2013-03-29T09:01:11.484Z

Frankie,

I think the proof of the pudding is in the eating. The April First Council has obviously not been able to achieve censorship or have the issue smothered. Censorship works much easier when the target of censorship opts to be mute. That won't happen here. And the discussion that opens up as a result of the Ethics Council behaviour flags up even more what the Irish News wanted hidden. So it backfires.

When god was giving out rules the Ethics Council thought he said fools
and asked for lots of them

Why I think it's an early Aprils fools joke is...

2013-03-29T01:35:31.391Z

Why I think it's an early Aprils fools joke is this....It is impossible to have filters, servers to capture all the traffic on the net. Setting up a blog, posting on youtube, Daily motion etc is easy. Unless some one pulls the plug or a solar storm knocks out the odd satelite. How can they censor anyone?

Gotta be an early Aprils fools...

This is the ethics
of the Ethics Council. Talk about protecting sources. It is disgraceful advice given out by the chair of the Council. I flagged this up to Simon from Censoria, a quaint English province where apparently Oswald Mosley is the role model, at the Ethics Council hearing - which was not a hearing - in Belfast on January 23.

Now Simon is not the sharpest tool in the box and obviously didn’t know anything about this. Like the incompetent Sarah Kavanagh he obviously keeps himself well informed. His intellectual prowess manifested itself in the pearl of wisdom ‘now is now and then was then.’ Duh. Rightly are the simple so called.

During the meeting I kept glancing over at Simon from Censoria. I thought he had a pencil with a rubber at each end of it. I wondered what he could actually do with such a device. It suited his bureaucratic personality. Simon is incapable of either writing anything down or rubbing anything out so sits perplexed by this pencil he has been given.

The NUJ does not like bloggers. It is a snobbish a...

2013-03-29T01:02:59.153Z

The NUJ does not like bloggers. It is a snobbish attitude but is there nonetheless. I think Roy Greenslade resigned from the union over the NUJ approach to internet writing.

Anyway, who has the will to win? Myself or the Ethical Council? Who can take the most flak and survive? Who can do isolation and ostracism the best?

These characteristics will define the side that emerges from this victorious.

It is not that they want merely me censored but...

2013-03-29T00:55:30.523Z

It is not that they want merely me censored but they are demanding that I censor you too or anybody else because they don't like what you say.

TPQ-ers, I still reckon it's an early Aprils fools joke.

Itsjustmacker, when I arrived with my solicitor t...

2013-03-29T00:48:05.938Z
Itsjustmacker,

when I arrived with my solicitor the Ethics Council moved to block him. So they told him it was not a disciplinary hearing but one aimed at mediation and reconciliation and that either me or my solicitor but not both could be admitted.

I opted to go in on the basis that it was not a disciplinary hearing and therefore I would not need a solicitor present and I would argue my case and discuss with Barnes/Morris the options. Which tio be fair to the journalists they did. But the Ethics Council lied.

That means we have an Ethics Council that lies through its teeth and which union members must be protected from. Who guards the guards? Who will investigate the Ethics Council for its breach of ethics? Or is lying ethical? Strange if it was in a journalists' union. This is why I will prevail in the end. Going a goal down at the start does not matter. It does not matter who I am up against, what finance they have behind them, what intimidation they can employ, what editorials they write, what bribes they might offer, what newspapers they edit or write for, what powerful union they make a career out of leeching from, in the end I will win. Be in no doubt about that.

Anthony: When you arrived with your Solicitor and...

2013-03-29T00:16:29.923Z
Anthony:

When you arrived with your Solicitor and were told it was informal and the Solicitor was not required.

I would say that the verdict was a foregone conclusion .

They found you guilty before you and your solicitor arrived.

Seems bigger powers were involved with the verdict.

Do you think the same?.

Before you reply, Please don't incriminate yourself.

But I agree with you, "Fuck Them".

How many committees of INJUSTICE have you been through!.

Michaelhenry, thanks a lot. Spot on about the PR....

2013-03-28T22:58:15.137Z
Michaelhenry,

thanks a lot. Spot on about the PR. Yes they organise along chapel lines and sometimes believe the nonsense that people in real chapels believe.

I have always liked the NUJ. And I did my best to work for it with some great people, among them some who have been critical of me on this issue. One of the critics was out on the drink with me in Liverpool at a conference a few years back and is a good guy. I bear him no grudge.

I just don't think they have been made aware of the issues. But allowing the wallies from the Ethics Council to censor me won't help them attain that understanding. But those who know me understand that I will not be censored.

What a clown I would be if I were to pay the slightest heed to a crowd of tossers who saw the opportunity for a junket and rushed over on the ship of fools. Fuck them.

Frankie, hard to believe. It is not that they wan...

2013-03-28T22:39:29.276Z
Frankie,

hard to believe. It is not that they want merely me censored but they are demanding that I censor you too or anybody else because they don't like what you say. This is what the whole issue is about. The Irish News is trying to cover its ass and smother legitimate concerns about its role in this thing. But I can live with it trying to fight its corner.

The Ethics Council is supposed to adjudicate fairly but from the get go lied to me and my lawyer. So we have lies coupled with incompetence by its serving officer. Regardless of who is right or wrong in the dispute between me and Morris/Barnes (and I believe I am right to have carried the views of others in the interests of free inquiry), the Ethics Council has behaved in a woeful fashion.

It is part of the Cosy Club and is trying to ensure that there will be limited scrutiny of its members in the papers from free lancers or bloggers. Let's protect journalists from the scrutiny that journalists want to subject others to.

And what has it achieved? Sweet FA. I am still here totally indifferent to its sanction and still allowing others to ask questions of the Irish News, Allison Morris and Ciaran Barnes. And of course I will give the Irish News or the journalists concerned the right to reply. I will not be censored.

The Ethics Council is a bastion of journalistic wankerdom and I sincerely hope you feel free to inform everybody of its wanker status.

Now let it move to discipline me again.